[wyliegirl]

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[jadeguppy]

The first looks to be a black pied. Where are you located? Some genetics run slightly different in different regions. I'll let someone else take a shot at the second one.

 

[Anne]

I agree in black pieblald.

What is the eye colour on the other one?

 

[wyliegirl]

The orange and white has black eyes

 

[jadeguppy]

Undermarked brindal? I have no idea if I'm right though. From what I have been told, colors like that one has slightly different genetics in Europe than they do in the US.

 

[Anne]

It looks red pied to me.

 

[Stina]

If you are in the US I'd say the yellow looks like a banded either recessive yellow or undermarked brindle. The black is either pied or banded...hard to say. If you're not in the US then they are pied or belted and the yellow one would probably be a poor red (lethal yellow/red).

 

[Laigaie]

If they came from a petstore rather than a breeder, banded or belted are very unlikely. I'd guess pied black and pied fawn (undermarked brindle).

 

[Anne]

but a fawn should have red eyes, that why I guessed red

it looks like a lot of A^y mice I have seen here (I havent seen more that a few pics of the recissive yellow, as I dont think we have it at all)

 

[Stina]

Banded isn't that uncommon in pet stores in the US....I had it from a pet store at one point. It depends where you are at.

fawn is not undermarked brindle...fawn is pink eyed red/yellow (either lethal or recessive). Recessive yellow, undermarked brindle, and lethal yellow (dominant "red," A^y) can all look pretty much exactly the same...

 

[Anne]

but what do you call a recissive yellow mouse then? I thought that they were still called "red" "fawn" and so on, even though it is the recissive gene?

 

[Laigaie]

They are, indeed! It's just good to know for your own records what you're guessing that you have, since Avy is a dominant variety and r is a recessive variety, it's quite easy to figure out quickly which it is. By saying fawn (undermarked brindle), I specify my guess as to genetic as well as phenotypic variety.

 

[Stina]

But fawn mice do not have black eyes...period. Fawn, under any club that uses that description, has PINK eyes. The mouse in the photo has black eyes...therefore it CANNOT be fawn. If you are going by phenotypic descriptions, the mouse is yellow/gold. I would not call it a red personally. The ECMA (East Coast Mouse Association) in the US has standards for gold mice, which is what that mouse falls into. The only ways to determine what that mouse is genetically is to know where it is from, breed it, and/or know its parentage. You absolutely cannot tell by that photo and the information provided if it is e/e, A^vy/*, or Ay/*

 

[Anne]

They are, indeed! It's just good to know for your own records what you're guessing that you have, since Avy is a dominant variety and r is a recessive variety, it's quite easy to figure out quickly which it is. By saying fawn (undermarked brindle), I specify my guess as to genetic as well as phenotypic variety.

Of course it is good to know, but I just read a couple of time now that people said that "no it is not red, it is recissive yellow" and I thougt of recissive yellow as another way to make the same colours without the downsides that A^y has. So that was just what I was wondering.

Btw, I wondered, if it isnt just a poor red, if it could be apricot

 

[Stina]

"recessive yellow" and "dominant red/lethal yellow" are both theoretically capable of producing the same range of colors from a light yellow to a dark red. "Recessive yellow" is e/e ....this is the same gene as in dogs that produces everything from nearly white yellow labs...to rich chestnut irish setters. The common names for the genes are misleading, as "recessive yellow" and "dominant red/lethal yellow" do NOT give any insight to the extreme range of possible shades that either gene can produce.......and "yellow" and "red" on their own really do not denote a specific gene.