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Can a mouse be both fox and tan? I remember reading a post on here where someone said they had a mouse that was both tan and fox.
My doe Mia has good markings for a tan or fox but very poor coloration. She has a pale tan belly and I think the top color is black but it's so dull I'm really not sure. Any ideas as to wether she is tan or fox? I'll try and post a better picture latter today.

 

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She's a tan. And no, they can't be both tan and fox. A tan has an orange belly (or a variation of that shade) and a fox has a white belly (or again a variation, a poor one could be creamy or have tan hairs at the demarcation line). A fox is a tan mouse with the chinchilla gene, so the orange (yellow) coloured hairs are bleached to white.

I think when someone said that a mouse is both tan and fox that they were trying to explain the genetics? I say this because to be a fox a mouse has to genetically be a tan on the a locus (at) and have two copies of the chinchilla gene on the c locus (cch/cch).
 

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It's a cavy or rabbit marking. Sadly there are no tan genes in rats. I can think of at least 2 rat fanciers wgo would sell their souls to the devil for tan, or for proper red ;)

http://www.nftcc.co.uk/ there is a gallery on there that shows the difference between the colours of otter and tan far better then I could explain it :)
 

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If you click on gallery on that webpage you will get lots of pictures. (The pic of the otter on the home page is not easy to see, I agree). I will double check the genetics, but it is a dilution of tan where the belly and other markings are a colour in between that of fox and tan.
 

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Ah I see, no I can't think of anything similar in mice. The equivalent would be classed as a poor tan or poor fox and so would be either culled or sent off to the pet shop, certainly not bred from. It reminds me a little of the mice produced when making foxes from scratch, sometimes they get a creamy coloured belly that's in between, but they look most like a fox.
 

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Interesting you say that, some people think stone is a beautiful colour and would like it standardised whereas others class it as a 'reject' in cream breeding. In other European countries it is standardised, and there is also the variety 'reverse siamese', which to me looks like a stone with a light nose and tail root (i.e. the big fault in pale selfs). It's certainly a good example of something not allowed here but accepted elsewhere. That also goes for things like 'coffee' in the US, which is classed as a poor, pale chocolate here and not recognised as a distinct separate colour.
 

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Stone is an interesting example, I guess to standardise it, a shade would have to be decided on as it does seem to be quite variable? The breeding of cream mice seems very similar to that of breeding cream cavies, where cream is not pure breeding either, and breeders use pew, buff and cream in the breeding mix to keep the required shade of cream. The main difference I guess is that buff has been standardised as a colour in cavies. In rats, there are colours standardised in other european countries that we don't have in the UK, and in the US there are more marked varieties standardised that breeders here would regard as rejects from other breeding and not worth pursuing. I find all these differences to be fascinating, and love to learn more :)
 

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I think it was me that said I had a fox/tan mouse, but I was just saying about the way she looks. She is a fox with parts of tan on her chin, armpit, around her 'privates', and where her tan line ends. I will show some pictures some time on another post
 

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Well I don't show anyways, and if I don't think I could show her anyways because she was supposed to be a feeder. Thanks for the help. I just love her because she is sooo sweet, very cute, and has prob. the biggest ears I have in my mice xD

Btw, my icon thing is her
 
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