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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
In Australia we officially don't have tricolour mice.

A few months ago I stumbled upon a young doe that looks suspiciously tri in a produce store. I was so excited!
I did tons of reading about how it works genetically, it must have been a fluke from a feeder breeder litter.



she is now 5 months of age and despite my efforts to fatten her up she is still sitting on 20g and has recently overcome a respiratory infection.

So my question is. Is it safe to breed from a 20g mouse.
It's possibly our only chance to have tri's in Australia, but I'm not sure if it' safe for such a small mouse to carry or care for a litter.

What are your thoughts?
 

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I don't know, having never done it - but lots of tiny does impregnated by litter brothers before 6 weeks raise their litters successfully. If I wanted to propagate a valuable, one-of-a-kind mouse, personally I would take the risk. I would love to see hooded mice, like the rat marking hooded, so if I happened upon one I'd breed it no question. I would certainly haunt the shop where a hooded mouse was found as well, to see if any more come in.

With the doe being so small, personally I would breed another (big healthy) doe at the same time, then cull her babies and either foster the majority of the tri's litter to her leaving the tri doe with two or three kittens, or I would let the tri and the foster doe raise the litter together. But it's all down to one's personal ethics etc, that's just how I would go about it :)

Sarah xxx
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I think there's been a misunderstanding.
She hasn't shown any symptoms of the disease for over a month now, she was medicated and I suspect it may have contributed to her stunted growth. I would never breed from a sick mouse, I don't care how rare it is.
My dilemma comes from her smaller size. As a rule of thumb I don't breed from does under 30g.
It might need to be an exception.

I'll talk it over with a friend from another mousery tommorow. She bred from a mouse that was 25g and it took a lot out of the mother. Sadly her mouse passed on and all the babies were also small. It's possible this mouse had a unknown flaw regardless of her size.
This is why I am of two minds.

I also know that I will likely not produce another tri for a few generations yet. The only stud I have available is a black siamese carrier. I have an oddball siamese marked buck in a 2 week old litter but I'm concerned by the time he is ready to breed my tri girl will be too old.

I am planning a chocolate litter soon if I consider fostering a few of her babies to another mother may be an option?
It might reduce the pressure of nursing a whole litter and hopefully she will cope with a smaller sized litter?
( I won't mention the "c" word because it is not a widely accepted practice in our fancy - but i understand where your comming from Sarah, I think it's a good idea)

I also have what I suspect is her brother, he is a badly mm bicolour (black/white) dutch, he is 30g. But using him would be a huge gamble because I have no idea if he carries the tri (splashed) gene at all. I have 3 siamese does (not all will be used in my shaded program) I can do a few trial litters.
 

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your mouse is a mouse of dutch origin(variety not place) which are smaller than all other varieties in the first place.I have a couple of dutch adults.I have a doe that has had two litters.I will weigh her later.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Actually Shirley is not a bad example of dutch in Australia!
I'd be focusing on getting another tri rather than reproducing it in dutch...one challenge at a time!
Although in years to come producing consistant tri dutches would be awesome ;) .

My friend and I are attempting to improve consistancy in dutch, we haven't had a great deal of sucess yet. It hasn't been a complete failure either, we do have some nice ones to work with still.
There have been several members of our club try dutch and give up fairly early in their programs.
We started with a few good pet store examples.
We are battling to breed out recessive white spotting and the PE gene.
Our dutch seem to be of reasonable size approx 35g for does.

Shirley was being sold as a feeder mouse, the store I went to sells them as live food for snakes. I suspect she may have been the result of several generations of inbreeding, which not only reduced her size, and caused suspected immuno-deficiencies but revieled the tricolour trait!
Outcrossing should help improve size and health in theory.
The buck I have in mind is fairly large and over 1 year 3 months of age from a good solid bloodline. I just wish he was siamese and not black.
 

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Ah, I see that I did misundertand, sorry, didn't mean to sound all judgmental. If she's recovered well enough, I'd do it in a heartbeat. And having another mouse ready to help in case you need to foster some of them is a good idea in any case. A lot of breeders probably do multiple litters at one time for this, and probably other, purposes. I know I do.
 

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What kind of medicine has she been treated with? The tetracycline family of antibiotics can cause reduced fertility in young females. I've heard that it can also cause abnormal bone growth in still-growing animals. Maybe that's why she's so small?

Unfortunately, especially when breeding an animal that is small, has been sick in the past, and/or when you have intention to possibly foster a whole litter, culling must be considered. It's not an easy topic to think about for some people, but there's no way around it in cases like this where you're taking a few different risks by breeding her. If you choose to breed her, knowing something could go wrong on multiple fronts, you must be prepared and willing to cull, even if it turns out you don't actually have to in the end. It's the only responsible approach other than not breeding her in the first place.

Regardless, I, too, agree with SarahY--I'd breed her. To a C-dilute male (himi, siamese, beige, etc) in case it is a tricolor like we have in the US...you'd need a C-dilute parent to get some splashed babies, who you could then breed to each other for tricolors.

I hope everything works out! :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I do have a himilayan available but was hesitant to introduce the PEW gene to the line because, like an undilute mouse, PEW might not be expressed as a tricolour (unless you got an odd eyed mouse :D ).

I suppose it would be an option. He's a good longcoat rex himilayan, one of the best mice I've bred.
 
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