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 Post subject: Color confusion!
PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 12:21 pm 
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Hey guys!

I’m super confused, pretty new into breeding and hope you can help me out with this one!

Male is a black dutch sh
Female is a Colorpoint heterozyg beige

And my babies are… this. And I really can’t define the color! On the dad’s side theres only Lilac/Chocolate and one RY.
On the mom’s side theres some Blue Burmese/Blue Point Siamese/Colorpoint Beige/Silver & one PEW.

But to me they don’t look like any of these! Could it be Sepia? and the hairless ones are heterozyg instead of completely nude right? Sorry, still trying to learn the terms. :roll:

I tried to take some pictures of them in daylight, hope you can help my newbie brain out :D :?

Links to pictures:

https://ibb.co/mYp52e
https://ibb.co/nnP52e
https://ibb.co/hfOnFz
https://ibb.co/iaApTK
https://ibb.co/d6sQ2e
https://ibb.co/fA67Fz
https://ibb.co/ikCgaz
https://ibb.co/gzU52e
https://ibb.co/dK452e
https://ibb.co/kQ0dNe
https://ibb.co/eWqdNe


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 Post subject: Re: Color confusion!
PostPosted: Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:47 am 
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Hi,

So a Black Dutch is: a/a B/* C/* D/* s/s. The gene creating Dutch is s/s, it is recessive piebald that formulates the pattern for a Dutch.
A Colorpoint Beige is a Siamese and Beige mouse, which is a/a B/* c^e/c^h D/* S/s. I am not sure why you put heterozyg. I think you mean heterogeneous, which is not necessary because Colorpoint Beige is a variation in itself.

Ok, so for carrying recessives:
Male: e, b, d
Female: d, c^ch, c^h, c, p

From the pictures, they look like Normal Black mice with white hairs- some already with hair and some growing hair. I do not think they are Hairless or Sepia mice. So it seems all of your mice are Normal Black with recessives. Your Dutch mouse was probably a/a B/b C/C D/d E/e S/S.

There you go. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Color confusion!
PostPosted: Wed Aug 22, 2018 8:00 am 
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I think they are all 'poor' blacks, and the last few are Rex coated (also known as fuzzy).



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 Post subject: Re: Color confusion!
PostPosted: Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:08 am 
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Lake Mousery wrote:
Hi,

So a Black Dutch is: a/a B/* C/* D/* s/s. The gene creating Dutch is s/s, it is recessive piebald that formulates the pattern for a Dutch.
A Colorpoint Beige is a Siamese and Beige mouse, which is a/a B/* c^e/c^h D/* S/s. I am not sure why you put heterozyg. I think you mean heterogeneous, which is not necessary because Colorpoint Beige is a variation in itself.

Ok, so for carrying recessives:
Male: e, b, d
Female: d, c^ch, c^h, c, p

From the pictures, they look like Normal Black mice with white hairs- some already with hair and some growing hair. I do not think they are Hairless or Sepia mice. So it seems all of your mice are Normal Black with recessives. Your Dutch mouse was probably a/a B/b C/C D/d E/e S/S.

There you go. :)



Hi there!

First of all, thanks for such a detailed answer. I understand NOTHING about dominant/recessive codes but I am beginning to study it more.
If you have a link that explains it all, that would be nice! (edit: found some in the forum!)

I added "heterozyg" cause she is a naked mice (and I thought it was what it meant.), but a Colorpoint Beige One. I'll insert pictures of her when I got her at 4weeks, and what she looks like now!

Like @WoodWitch said, I also thought they were Normal Black in the beginning but since they are "poor" in color, I really thought it was something else.
But yes, makes sense now. :)

I although think that some of them are SH but the rest could possibly end up Nude or be Rex? Since the female is a Nude.

I found their gene codes:
Female is: aa c(e)c(e) Nunu
Male is: aa Bb Dd Ee ss

Pictures: first one is at 4weeks: https://ibb.co/evWPxe
second one is just taken (as you can see she has a tiny coating of fur, not much though! is the right term "Nude" then?) : https://ibb.co/myuzVz


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 Post subject: Re: Color confusion!
PostPosted: Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:24 pm 
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No problem. WoodWitch is correct that the mice that have partially naked fur are Rex coats. Further supported in the last picture. I forgot Rex is a dominant gene, I only breed Normal and Satin coats so I forgot about it.

What is SH or Nude? Do you mean hairless? Nunu does not look like a hairless. Beige Rex if I had to guess. You can use this website to easily calculate the genotypes of the offspring: http://scienceprimer.com/punnett-square-calculator

Mouse genetic links:
http://www.afrma.org/geneticsblackmse.htm
http://www.informatics.jax.org/wksilver ... e1-1.shtml


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 Post subject: Re: Color confusion!
PostPosted: Wed Aug 22, 2018 5:42 pm 
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Lake Mousery wrote:
No problem. WoodWitch is correct that the mice that have partially naked fur are Rex coats. Further supported in the last picture. I forgot Rex is a dominant gene, I only breed Normal and Satin coats so I forgot about it.

What is SH or Nude? Do you mean hairless? Nunu does not look like a hairless. Beige Rex if I had to guess. You can use this website to easily calculate the genotypes of the offspring: http://scienceprimer.com/punnett-square-calculator

Mouse genetic links:
http://www.afrma.org/geneticsblackmse.htm
http://www.informatics.jax.org/wksilver ... e1-1.shtml


Haha yeah, alright!
SH just means Short Hair.
Well here in Europe/Denmark we use Nude (or Nunu) for my type of mouse, so hairless to Rex I would guess. It's impossible to find a good quality Rex here (or Astrex & Texel for that matter) so they probably gave it "the same name" since it's hard to differentiate them.

Awesome links, thanks a lot. :-)
And thanks again, now I know what to write when they'll be old enough to be sold haha.


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 Post subject: Re: Color confusion!
PostPosted: Wed Aug 22, 2018 9:08 pm 
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Ohitslilly wrote:

Haha yeah, alright!
SH just means Short Hair.
Well here in Europe/Denmark we use Nude (or Nunu) for my type of mouse, so hairless to Rex I would guess. It's impossible to find a good quality Rex here (or Astrex & Texel for that matter) so they probably gave it "the same name" since it's hard to differentiate them.

Awesome links, thanks a lot. :-)
And thanks again, now I know what to write when they'll be old enough to be sold haha.


Rex is just short for Astrex :)

As for heterozyg/homozyg, they're not really terms used for mice, mostly for reptiles. For rodents you use dominant, recessive and carriers.



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 Post subject: Re: Color confusion!
PostPosted: Wed Aug 22, 2018 10:43 pm 
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Oh, thats weird. Thats what she was marked as "Colourpoint beige heterozyg nude".
But they're for sure not Rex/Astrex, they should have a much thicker coat. Is there anything as an Naked Rex maybe?
Or could they just be Fuzzy then?

I'm still so confused haha.


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